The character tab/deck of the sidebar shows all sorts of information about your font: Family, size, bold Y/N, Italic Y/N and others. Many of these - specifically, the ones I mentioned - are actually defined for each language group: Western, RTL-CTL and CJK. But the tab/deck does not let us switch between the three language groups. There should be some control for doing that. Possibility (not necessarily the best one): A button for switching to the next language group according to some cyclic order.
-1 to bloat the sidebar. It should be kept as clean and easy to access as possible. I'd expect the RTL/CJK attributes to be shown depending on the text, which is actually the fact.
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #1) > -1 to bloat the sidebar. It should be kept as clean and easy to access as > possible. No it shouldn't. We already have the formatting toolbar, which limits us to only a few controls and only for the current language group. The sidebar has more, as well it should. And we should be able to change the character style at the cursor position, including the choices of other LG than the nearby character's. Suppose I want to write a word in German in a paragraph that is otherwise Arabic. How will I choose the typeface and size for it? With the current approach (and assuming I don't use the menus), I need to type it, then select it, then format it. This is a hassle, and is not even so easy with the conflicting directions of the stretches of text. Anyway, it can be be made less prominent than a full-fledged drop-down box, e.g. some kind of mini control on the top bar of Character (maybe like the language selection on the Linux/Windows panel), near the gear wheel; or a narrow icon before the typeface combo box. etc. > I'd expect the RTL/CJK attributes to be shown depending on the > text, which is actually the fact. This argument cannot be made before bug 148257 is resolved, as otherwise, one cannot set the language (nor language group) of text in LibreOffice. And the same piece of text may change its language due to typing or deletion of _other_ characters, nearby. Specifically, think of numbers and punctuation marks.
Hi Eyal, (In reply to Eyal Rozenberg from comment #0) > Many of these - specifically, the ones I mentioned - are actually defined > for each language group: Western, RTL-CTL and CJK. But the tab/deck does not > let us switch between the three language groups. There should be some > control for doing that. I would expect that switching language group is used very much less frequent than the others?
(In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #3) > I would expect that switching language group is used very much less frequent > than the others? Actually, not really... think of it this way: You are editing a document which has both Arabic and English content. Occasionally, you want to make a few CS changes (font, weight, size, etc.) ; what is the probability that this set of changes is in the same language group as the previous set of changes? Roughly, and not knowing anything about the document about the fraction of the Arabic and the English content. It could be high and it could be low. But not just this: What is the probability that the next set of changes is of the same language as the previous one? that figure is tilted even more towards 50% than the last figure.
The SB Properties deck holds a Character content panel. The SB Properties deck is an Omni panel assembling details across the document and UI defaults. But agree there is utility to expose current language/locale on the SB Properties deck. Would be for focused paragraph, or respond to a selection (will likely be needed for bug 148257). Currently, the Properties deck will respond to text spans receiving CJK/CTL Paragraph style handling by ICU lib detection. Where user configures their defaults (or current document) choices from Tools -> Options -> Language & Locale -> General. So any text spans in the document will pick up just those single Western/CJK/CTL font assignments in the Paragraph styles in the Styles deck and are also exposed on the Properties deck--when no Direct Formatting overrides. Alternatively explicit DF setting of language at the Paragraph object level reflects associated font in the Properties deck--but no language tagging beyond what is below on the Status bar. At a minimum, until bug 148257 allows more, exposing the same "trifecta" PS details used for the Status bar in the Properties deck seems reasonable start.
We discussed the topic in the design meeting. While the indication was accepted and in principle this request too, it is unclear what switching the language group mean. Suppose a text belongs to Western that uses Liberation as font, what happens when you switch to CTL? Adopt the setting from the respective field and change the font to Alef and the language to Arabic, for example?
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #6) > We discussed the topic in the design meeting. While the indication was > accepted and in principle this request too, it is unclear what switching the > language group mean. It means that you would be able to set the CS features for another language group. > Suppose a text belongs to Western that uses Liberation as font, what happens > when you switch to CTL? Adopt the setting from the respective field and > change the font to Alef and the language to Arabic, for example? The same thing would happen as when you set the RTL-CTL font in the Format > Character... dialog. That is, the Western text is not affected by the language-group-specific settings.
How do I switch "Lorem ipsum" from Western to CTL right now? What should happen if the text "איפסום דולור" is set as Western?
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #8) You are confused. The request is not to switch the properties of the *content*; this is a request to switch the *sidebar panel*, so that it shows all three of the group properties.
(In reply to Mike Kaganski from comment #9) > so that it shows all three of the group properties. ... not simultaneously, but any one of the three, based on what user selects.
(In reply to Mike Kaganski from comment #9) Mike is right, Heiko has misunderstood the request. > The request is not to switch the properties of the *content*; this is a > request to switch the *sidebar panel*, so that it shows all three of the > group properties. ... > ... not simultaneously, but any one of the three, based on what user selects. Exactly. I will amend the title to (hopefully) clarify.
[Automated Action] NeedInfo-To-Unconfirmed
(In reply to Mike Kaganski from comment #10) > ... not simultaneously, but any one of the three, based on what user selects. The request makes even less sense to me in this case. Also in relation to bug 153992. A strong -1 to show non-relevant information in the sidebar.
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #13) > A strong -1 to show non-relevant information in the sidebar. Heiko, how often do you write text in two language groups? These two bugs stem from the experience of doing so. And both of the language groups are relevant even while my cursor my currently be on a word that is in one group or the other. Just like the sidebar shows me the paragraph settings (but not the page settings) even though I may not have anything selected: It is likely I would want to tweak them in the middle of "working at the character level" (i.e. typing text). Moreover, think about what happens when I actually make a selection which has text from two language groups. Today, I immediately lose the ability to set the typeface - since the sidebar will only show properties common to both language groups, and the rest will just be deselected/empty.
(In reply to Eyal Rozenberg from comment #14) > Heiko, how often do you write text in two language groups? These two bugs > stem from the experience of doing so. And both of the language groups are > ... (In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #3) > I would expect that switching language group is used very much less frequent > than the others? Me and Heiko have little to no reference to understand how frequent writing text in multiple language groups happens :) This makes understanding the use case of your request even harder. (In reply to Eyal Rozenberg from comment #14) > or the other. Just like the sidebar shows me the paragraph settings (but not > the page settings) even though I may not have anything selected: It is > likely I would want to tweak them in the middle of "working at the character > level" (i.e. typing text). That is: while typing a word, you may select a different language group for that text? (In reply to Eyal Rozenberg from comment #14) > Moreover, think about what happens when I actually make a selection which > has text from two language groups. Today, I immediately lose the ability to > set the typeface - since the sidebar will only show properties common to > both language groups, and the rest will just be deselected/empty. I understand that. It's not similar to your initial request, I think?