LibreOffice 4.1.4.2 on Ubuntu 13.04. 1. Create a new document in Writer. 2. Using the Drawing toolbar, draw 3 rectangles in a row, left to right, drawing the middle one a little smaller than the other 2. Leave the right-hand one selected. 3. Shift-click the left-hand rectangle to make a multiple selection that contains the left & right rectangles. 4. The displayed selection-handles change from being on the edges of the right-hand rectangle to being on the edges of the bounding box of the 2-rectangle selection. 5. Issue: There is nothing visible to indicate that the middle rectangle isn't selected but the left & right rectangles are selected. This is especially a problem if the user is Shift-clicking items like the middle rectangle to add them to, or subtract them from, the multiple selection - there is no visual cue that the Shift-click of the middle rectangle did anything. (Since the middle rectangle is entirely within the bounding box of the left-&-right-rectangle selection.) Inkscape and Dia give much better visual feedback of multiple selections: * Inkscape draws dashed lines around the individual objects. * Dia continues to show the selection handles of the individual objects, but changes the handle colour & makes the handles unselectable. I prefer Dia's approach. The dashed lines in Inkscape can be hard to see, and may require more coding work (than changing the handle colour) to add to LO. I think LO should still have selection handles for the bounding box so the selected objects can be resized collectively.
Confirmed - Set as Enhancement and New - Sophie
*** Bug 74365 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
reproducible Version: 4.5.0.0.alpha0+ Build ID: 170616e9f2d30c1302bbb5a7a4b588bc05cd5cc9 TinderBox: Win-x86@39, Branch:master, Time: 2014-12-12_01:58:46 Locale: en_US Still valid enhancement but affects the drawing UI in both writer and draw (bug 74365). Q: UX impact of not doing it Q: how difficult to adjust UI, assume in svtools/vcl Q: priority @dlg1727 -- could you attach clips from DIA and Inkscape, as well as mockup of what your ideal implementation on LibreOffice might look like?
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #3) > @dlg1727 -- could you attach clips from DIA and Inkscape, as well as mockup > of what your ideal implementation on LibreOffice might look like? DIA (and Microsoft Word 2013): https://youtu.be/jXPhSCfK-GI Inkscape: https://youtu.be/g5j00bAsvaQ An alternative is to highlight the object. Balsamiq Mockups 3: https://youtu.be/1e9tJZZBuhg The Inkscape way is also known in other apps as ant trail with animation. This is often reported as annoying and counterproductive. Personal favorite is the DIA solution. Moving the issue to Draw.
*** Bug 95477 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Created attachment 134339 [details] Demonstration of the problem by comparison to PowerPoint As additional documentation I attach a screenshot-comparison I used in a superuser-question about this issue, where I tried to demonstrate the visual feedback when selecting four circles in a drawing, and how there is no feedback about whether the middle circle or any other elements within the selection rectangle in addition to the circles are selected. Note how in the Libreoffice-Screenshot the selection-reactangle actually indicates that I accidentially did *not* select the circle as intended, but the equation or line instead - which I didn't even notice before posting; This demonstrates that even when there is feedback about doing the selection wrong, it is still easily missed.
Press F8 or the icon "Points" (which are toggles) to switch to point mode to get the same view as in Microsoft Office. I do not see, what should be enhanced beyond. Besides that, the count of selected objects is shown in the status bar in Draw/Impress.
(In reply to Regina Henschel from comment #7) > Press F8 or the icon "Points" (which are toggles) to switch to point mode to > get the same view as in Microsoft Office. I do not see, what should be > enhanced beyond. Besides that, the count of selected objects is shown in the > status bar in Draw/Impress. Isn't this workaround mixing different functions?
(In reply to Regina Henschel from comment #7) > Press F8 or the icon "Points" (which are toggles) to switch to point mode to > get the same view as in Microsoft Office. I do not see, what should be > enhanced beyond. Besides that, the count of selected objects is shown in the > status bar in Draw/Impress. The count doesn't really help the issue. The usability question usually isn't "how many elements are selected" but "which of the elements are selected?". Furthermore, by requiring looking away from the canvas, it affects the work-flow negatively, even for cases where it provides sufficient information. Thank you for the F8 hint however; It mostly solves the issue for me. It is a rather non-obvious solution though. Had I merely read about it somewhere, I would probably forget about it after a while and other users won't think of it at all. The net effect is that the selection highlighting looks *by default* inferior to comparable software. Such details create a feeling of "being less productive than one could be", so they shouldn't be taken lightly.
(In reply to Klaus from comment #6) > Created attachment 134339 [details] > Demonstration of the problem by comparison to PowerPoint Selecting multiple objects works as a temporary group in LibreOffice and for that the green handles of the bounding box is the correct visualization. MS Office works different. If you drag a handle of one selected object, the transformation is done the same way for all selected objects. Such behavior is not available in LibreOffice. The other way round, temporarily grouping is not available in MS Office (at least I don't know it). So MS Office is not suitable for a comparison. Inkscape behaves the same as LibreOffice, but shows dotted lines or a little cross mark or nothing on selected objects, dependent on its application settings. CorelDraw behaves the same as LibreOffice too, but has a little square as indicator at the 'start' of the object. (In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #8) > Isn't this workaround mixing different functions? Of cause point mode is a special mode. But if the decision will be to introduce such indicator, that does not mean, that it will be implemented in the foreseeable future. For my personal needs point mode is enough, but I notice that such indicator will help users. Still to be clarified: Which indicator? Make it configurable? The component "Draw" is too narrow, you need such feature in Writer, Impress and Calc too.
ACD Canvas behavior is perhaps a little more intuitive. Selecting multiple objects (with Shift-click adding them to the temporary group) simply activates those objects showing handles on them. If you then click and drag one, they all get dragged (i.e. members of the temporary group). If you resize one, they all are INDIVIDUALLY resized the same amount. Etc. Clicking outside of any of the multiple objects deselects them all. I kind of like that behavior, but then I grew up with it in Mac then Windows.
Created attachment 153597 [details] Only Office multiple objects selection, point selection I would like to request that the Points (F8) view is made the default one, for the following reasons: - it is the behaviour expected by users of other office suites (Microsoft Office, GDocs, WPS Office, Only Office and Softmaker Office have this behaviour). If an user does the same in LibreOffice and does not see the same result he will assume it is a bug, despite there being historical reasons for not being presented that way. - The points view allows to easily see which objects are selected. This is especially useful if one is selecting dozens of objects assembled in a specific order and with multiple ones overlaping. Only Office also has a point selection in which it shows the multiple objets selected
Created attachment 153598 [details] Powerpoint selection Therefore I would propose that the Points selection is turned on by default starting with 6.4.
(In reply to Pedro from comment #13) > Created attachment 153598 [details] > Powerpoint selection > > Therefore I would propose that the Points selection is turned on by default > starting with 6.4. Looks a very sensible solution to me.
(In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #14) > (In reply to Pedro from comment #13) > > Created attachment 153598 [details] > > Powerpoint selection > > > > Therefore I would propose that the Points selection is turned on by default > > starting with 6.4. > Looks a very sensible solution to me. However... with F8 draging a selection handler only resizes the shape with that handler, whereas in the current situation, all is resized. So a different behavior. We could try and see what people find..
We talked about this topic, and in particular Pedro's suggestion, in the design meeting. Obvious difference between point mode on and off is that in multi-selection not all objects are resized. But this "drawback" doesn't outweigh the advantage respective selection. So let's enable it by default and switch back in case many people will complain.
(In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #15) > (In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #14) > > (In reply to Pedro from comment #13) > > > Created attachment 153598 [details] > > > Powerpoint selection > > > > > > Therefore I would propose that the Points selection is turned on by default > > > starting with 6.4. > > Looks a very sensible solution to me. > However... with F8 draging a selection handler only resizes the shape with > that handler, whereas in the current situation, all is resized. So a > different behavior. We could try and see what people find.. Indeed. However, I believe that should be a topic for another bug, to require that it resizes all selected shapes.
(In reply to Pedro from comment #17) > Indeed. However, I believe that should be a topic for another bug, to > require that it resizes all selected shapes. No, that would be contrary to the point mode. You can always use the Position&Size dialog to work on the entire selection.