Bug 100530 - Unable to access LibreOffice Online menu or toolbar (CollaboraCloudSuite) via keyboard when using a screen reader
Summary: Unable to access LibreOffice Online menu or toolbar (CollaboraCloudSuite) via...
Status: NEW
Alias: None
Product: LibreOffice Online
Classification: Unclassified
Component: LibreOffice (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
unspecified
Hardware: All All
: medium normal
Assignee: Not Assigned
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords: accessibility
: 99785 (view as bug list)
Depends on:
Blocks: a11y
  Show dependency treegraph
 
Reported: 2016-06-21 19:34 UTC by Alex ARNAUD
Modified: 2019-11-26 11:40 UTC (History)
10 users (show)

See Also:
Crash report or crash signature:


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Description Alex ARNAUD 2016-06-21 19:34:28 UTC
Dear LibreOffice online contritors,

I'm trying to use Writer with a screen reader because I'm a blind person but the menu is completely inaccessible.

Steps to reproduce :
1) Launch the Orca screen reader (on GNU/Linux)
1) Go to Collabora Online
2) Open the basic-text file
3) Activate the navigation mode (with Orca+a)
4) Try to access the menu

Result: there are lot of images on the page but nothing understandable for a blind person
Expected result: access to all button and the menu bar

Best regards.
Comment 1 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-22 01:52:07 UTC
Kind of poorly worded. But maybe one of the regular Orca users will have some insight.
Comment 2 Joanmarie Diggs 2016-06-22 02:04:51 UTC
How do you go to Collabora Online?
Comment 3 Alex ARNAUD 2016-06-22 09:58:15 UTC
(In reply to Joanmarie Diggs from comment #2)
> How do you go to Collabora Online?

Dear Joanmarie,

You can go on Collabora online here : https://www.collaboraoffice.com/solutions/collabora-cloudsuite/

Best regards.
Comment 4 Alex ARNAUD 2016-06-22 10:06:46 UTC
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #1)
> Kind of poorly worded. But maybe one of the regular Orca users will have
> some insight.

Dear MR. V Stuart Foote,

what do you expect ? I'm a regular Orca user, I use it everyday and I want to contribute with the QA team.
I am hurt by your words because I'm trying to give you the most useful feedback as possible.

Best regards.
Comment 5 Jean-Philippe MENGUAL 2016-06-24 08:52:59 UTC
Hi,

I tried myself and had the problem. Stuart, can you reproduce? Or is there another way to open the menubar in this context?

Regards,
Comment 6 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-24 16:04:02 UTC
Confirming - on Windows 10 Pro 64-bit en-US with FireFox 47.0 and NVDA 2016.1

Took a moment and figured out Collabora's LibreOffice Online offer and registered for a Collabora CloudSuite demo.

The GUI is OK, and mouse based navigation moves one to the menus, but during editing found the edit cursor gets detached from its position on the canvas.

The listing of keyboard shorts does not provide any navigation between GUI control elements, and I was unable to identify any.

Unfortunately, most of the GUI for the document canvas is not exposed as NVDA accessible events with default modules--the content is uninteligible "blank". NV Access may need to work with Collabora on a module.

If things are similar with Orca reader (expect that they are) at this point the Collabora CloudSuite should be considered completely not accessible with limited AT support--they have work to do.


Here are the currently listed Collabora CloudSuite keyboard shortcuts for anyone interested.

Keyboard Shortcuts
General Keyboard Shortcuts
Undo 	Ctrl + Z
Redo 	Ctrl + Y
Cut 	Ctrl + X
Paste as unformatted text 	Ctrl + Alt + Shift + V
Print (Download as PDF) 	Ctrl + P
Text formatting
Bold 	Ctrl + B
Italic 	Ctrl + I
Underline 	Ctrl + U
Double Underline 	Ctrl + D
Strikethrough 	Ctrl + Alt + 5
Superscript 	Ctrl + Shift + P
Subscript 	Ctrl + Shift + B
Remove direct formatting 	Ctrl + M
Paragraph formatting
Align Center 	Ctrl + E
Align Left 	Ctrl + L
Align Right 	Ctrl + R
Justify 	Ctrl + J
Apply Default paragraph style 	Ctrl + 0
Apply Heading 1 paragraph style 	Ctrl + 1
Apply Heading 2 paragraph style 	Ctrl + 2
Apply Heading 3 paragraph style 	Ctrl + 3
Apply Heading 4 paragraph style 	Ctrl + 4
Apply Heading 5 paragraph style 	Ctrl + 5
Text selection and navigation in document
Select All 	Ctrl + A
Move cursor to the left 	Arrow Left
Move cursor with selection to the left 	Shift + Arrow Left
Go to beginning of a word 	Ctrl + Arrow Left
Select to the left word by word 	Ctrl + Shift + Arrow Left
Move cursor to the right 	Arrow Right
Move cursor with selection to the right 	Shift + Arrow Right
Go to start of the next word 	Ctrl + Arrow Right
Select to the right word by word 	Ctrl + Shift + Arrow Right
Move cursor up one line 	Arrow Up
Select lines in upwards direction 	Shift + Arrow Up
Move cursor to beginning of the previous paragraph 	Ctrl + Arrow Up
Select to beginning of paragraph 	Ctrl + Shift + Arrow Up
Move cursor down one line 	Arrow Down
Select lines in downwards direction 	Shift + Arrow Down
Move cursor to beginning of the next paragraph 	Ctrl + Arrow Down
Select to end of paragraph 	Ctrl + Shift + Arrow Down
Go to beginning of line 	Home
Go and select to the beginning of a line 	Shift + Home
Go to start of document 	Ctrl + Home
Go and select text to start of document 	Ctrl + Shift + Home
Go to end of line 	End
Go and select to the end of a line 	Shift + End
Go to end of document 	Ctrl + End
Go and select text to end of document 	Ctrl + Shift + End
Move the view up one page 	PageUp
Switch cursor between text and header 	Ctrl + PageUp
Extend the selection up one page 	Shift + PageUp
Move the view down one page 	PageDown
Switch cursor between text and footer 	Ctrl + PageDown
Extend the selection down one page 	Shift + PageDown
Delete to beginning of word 	Ctrl + Backspace
Delete to end of word 	Ctrl + Del
Delete to beginning of sentence 	Ctrl + Shift + Backspace
Delete to end of sentence 	Ctrl + Shift + Del
Shortcut Keys for Tables
Ctrl + A 	If the active cell is empty: selects the whole table. Otherwise: selects the contents of the active cell. Pressing again selects the entire table.
Ctrl + Home 	If the active cell is empty: goes to the beginning of the table. Otherwise: first press goes to beginning of the active cell, second press goes to beginning of the current table, third press goes to beginning of document.
Ctrl + End 	If the active cell is empty: goes to the end of the table. Otherwise: first press goes to the end of the active cell, second press goes to the end of the current table, third press goes to the end of the document.
Ctrl + Tab 	Inserts a tab stop (only in tables). Depending on the Window Manager in use, Alt + Tab may be used instead.
Alt + Arrow Keys 	Increases/decreases the size of the column/row on the right/bottom cell edge
Alt + Shift + Arrow Keys 	Increase/decrease the size of the column/row on the left/top cell edge
Alt + Ctrl + Arrow Keys 	Like Alt, but only the active cell is modified
Ctrl + Alt + Shift + Arrow Keys 	Like Alt, but only the active cell is modified
Alt + Insert 	3 seconds in Insert mode, Arrow Key inserts row/column, Ctrl + Arrow Key inserts cell
Alt + Del 	3 seconds in Delete mode, Arrow key deletes row/column, Ctrl + Arrow key merges cell with neighboring cell
Shift + Ctrl + Del 	If no whole cell is selected, the text from the cursor to the end of the current sentence is deleted. If the cursor is at the end of a cell, and no whole cell is selected, the contents of the next cell are deleted.

If no whole cell is selected and the cursor is at the end of the table, the paragraph following the table will be deleted, unless it is the last paragraph in the document.

If one or more cells are selected, the whole rows containing the selection will be deleted. If all rows are selected completely or partially, the entire table will be deleted.
Word processor functions
Insert footnote 	Ctrl + Alt + F
Insert endnote 	Ctrl + Alt + D
Insert comment 	Ctrl + Alt + C
Insert soft hyphen 	Ctrl + -
Insert non-breaking hyphen 	Ctrl + Shift + -
Insert non-breaking space 	Ctrl + Shift + Space
Insert line break 	Shift + Enter
Manual page break 	Ctrl + Enter
Column break (in multicolumnar text) 	Ctrl + Shift + Enter
Insert new paragraph directly before or after a section, or before a table 	Alt + Enter
Insert new paragraph without numbering inside a list. Does not work when the cursor is at the end of the list. 	Alt + Enter
Comment 7 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-24 16:20:26 UTC
@Michael, seem to have some significant accessibility issues with the LibreOffice Online CollaboraCloudSute.  No discoverable navigation to the menu, and toolbar and document canvas, the F6, F10 used by LO Desktop apps are held by Browser.

Also, the multiline editable content of the document canvas is not being resolved--at least by NVDA.

@Jamie, just checked using NVDA 2016.2.1 and no improvement. Is the LibreOffice Online going to need its own module--I know it is not Symphony/IAccessible2/MSAA based like the Desktop.  Has anyone from Collabora touched base with you and Mic?
Comment 8 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-24 16:33:36 UTC
Opened a ticket with NVDA project

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/6111
Comment 9 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-25 12:09:05 UTC
*** Bug 99785 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 10 Michael Meeks 2016-06-25 15:33:45 UTC
I am not hyper-optimistic about accessibility for LibreOffice Online - ultimately we have to integrate with browser APIs here - and our model (which is similar in some ways to a terminal server / VNC approach) will cause issues I guess - last I looked at ARIA it seemed very weak on annotating dynamic content; I've no idea how widespread canvas / widget toolkit use will fit there.

What would help would be to get some input, and ideally funding from the a11y community; it is entirely possible that the browser APIs are inadequate for our needs here: ie. mirroring and exposing an existing remote a11y object hierarchy in the browser.

So for the meantime; I'd suggest continuing to use the PC version - which is (anyhow) more functional.

Hope that helps !
Comment 11 Buovjaga 2019-04-15 07:23:33 UTC
(In reply to Michael Meeks from comment #10)
> I am not hyper-optimistic about accessibility for LibreOffice Online -
> ultimately we have to integrate with browser APIs here - and our model
> (which is similar in some ways to a terminal server / VNC approach) will
> cause issues I guess - last I looked at ARIA it seemed very weak on
> annotating dynamic content; I've no idea how widespread canvas / widget
> toolkit use will fit there.

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Accessibility/ARIA/ARIA_Live_Regions
https://developer.paciellogroup.com/blog/2014/03/screen-reader-support-aria-live-regions/
http://pauljadam.com/demos/aria-atomic-relevant.html
http://pauljadam.com/demos/aria-alert-validation.html
https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/ARIA19.html
https://howlowck.github.io/ARIA-Demo/pages/live-regions.html
https://marcus.io/blog/a11y-app-shopping-cart-with-aria-live

It might be true that having ~everything be dynamic is a showstopper.

The thing is, LibO Online can never enter the U.S. market, if this is not addressed. Any serious users would get sued.
Comment 12 Michael Meeks 2019-04-15 13:43:46 UTC
Needless to say we take these things very seriously, and Marco is working on improving things here.
Comment 13 Xisco Faulí 2019-09-26 10:27:44 UTC
Dear Marco Cecchetti,
This bug has been in ASSIGNED status for more than 3 months without any
activity. Resetting it to NEW.
Please assigned it back to yourself if you're still working on this.