Bug 109117 - Mistranslation in French
Summary: Mistranslation in French
Status: RESOLVED NOTABUG
Alias: None
Product: LibreOffice
Classification: Unclassified
Component: Localization (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
5.4.0.1 rc
Hardware: All All
: medium normal
Assignee: Not Assigned
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2017-07-14 10:34 UTC by French.l10n
Modified: 2017-10-02 08:48 UTC (History)
3 users (show)

See Also:
Crash report or crash signature:


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Description French.l10n 2017-07-14 10:34:40 UTC
Description:
In the French translation Tools => Autoinput is translated by "AutoSaisie" which means "Self input". The proper translation is "Saisie semi-automatique".

Actual Results:  
AutoSaisie

Expected Results:
Saisie semi-automatique


Reproducible: Always

User Profile Reset: No

Additional Info:


User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10_11_4) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/51.0.2704.106 Safari/537.36 OPR/38.0.2220.41
Comment 1 sophie 2017-07-14 11:06:51 UTC
Hi, that doesn't mean self input but automatic input, but I'll discuss it with Jean-Baptiste, this translation is there for years, not sure there is a benefit in changing it - Sophie
Comment 2 French.l10n 2017-07-17 17:57:59 UTC
Not at all. Translating "Autoinput" by "AutoSaisie" is just bad translating, and the fact that is has been there for years surely can't be a valid argument:

"Le préfixe auto-, du grec autos, signifie « soi-même » et il est soudé au mot qui le suit, sauf si ce mot commence par un i ou par un u. Le trait d’union est aussi préférable lorsque le second élément commence par un o.

Exemples :

- Cette entreprise a eu recours à un autofinancement.
- Ils ont demandé à leurs employés de faire une autoévaluation de leur rendement.
- Le four autonettoyant facilite grandement l’entretien de la cuisinière.
- L’auto-immunisation peut prévenir l’auto-infection.
- Nous travaillons à la conception d’une nouvelle antenne auto-orientable."

Best regards
Comment 3 sophie 2017-07-18 07:54:12 UTC
So, still your translation doesn't reflect what the functionality is doing: automatically completing a word that has already been entered in the same row. Alos AutoSomething is translated to Autoquelquechose every where in the product (with the same idea behind of a shortcut for automatic), so for consistency it should be replaced everywhere.
Changing something that is here for years has a cost, users have to get used to it, documentation, training material and so on has to be changed, etc. 
Jean-Baptiste and me are working on FR l10n, we will decide together if it has to be changed. BTW on which project are you French Language Coordinator? Sophie
Comment 4 French.l10n 2017-07-18 12:07:33 UTC
"Saisie semi-automatique" définit une fonction qui permet à l'utilisateur d'entrer uniquement les premiers caractères d'un champ déjà tapée précédemment et d'obtenir automatiquement le contenu du champ.

It is much longer, yes, but could be something else. Like any good translation, thoughts have to go into it. Quality does not always come easy.  

The fact that a translation has been wrong one way or another for years cannot possibly be a reason not to correct it. This kind of logic implies that if a coding bug has been present for such a long time that users are now used to the buggy behaviour, then it shouldn't be corrected.

A discussion needs to be open to get anywhere, and the result of a true resolution process, not a unilateral decision between your and your colleague.
Comment 5 sophie 2017-07-18 12:14:40 UTC
(In reply to French Language Coordinator from comment #4)
> "Saisie semi-automatique" définit une fonction qui permet à l'utilisateur
> d'entrer uniquement les premiers caractères d'un champ déjà tapée
> précédemment et d'obtenir automatiquement le contenu du champ.
> 
> It is much longer, yes, but could be something else. Like any good
> translation, thoughts have to go into it. Quality does not always come easy.

So what is your proposal? what for other identical strings in the UI?
> 
> 
> The fact that a translation has been wrong one way or another for years
> cannot possibly be a reason not to correct it. This kind of logic implies
> that if a coding bug has been present for such a long time that users are
> now used to the buggy behaviour, then it shouldn't be corrected.
> 
> A discussion needs to be open to get anywhere, and the result of a true
> resolution process, not a unilateral decision between your and your
> colleague.

My colleague as you said and me are translating UI and help of this product since more than 17 years, so yes as doers, we will discuss it together and make a decision how we think this translation is best. Sophie
Comment 6 Jean-Baptiste Faure 2017-07-19 15:32:20 UTC
For me the translation "AutoSaisie" is correct, as I consider that the actor here is the application: the user allows the application to enter data itself (please note the checkbox in front of the menu entry).

So closing as NotABug.

Best regards. JBF
Comment 7 Adolfo Jayme Barrientos 2017-07-20 17:04:37 UTC
FWIW, long ago I changed e.g. “Autocorrección” in the Spanish localization for “Corrección automática”, for this exact reason.
Comment 8 French.l10n 2017-09-29 20:38:54 UTC
(In reply to Jean-Baptiste Faure from comment #6)
> For me the translation "AutoSaisie" is correct, as I consider that the actor
> here is the application: the user allows the application to enter data
> itself (please note the checkbox in front of the menu entry).
> 
> So closing as NotABug.
> 
> Best regards. JBF

Unfortunately, "autosaisie" and "saisie automatique" or "saisie semi-automatique" are very different concepts and marking this bug as resolved and not a bug doesn't change the reality of this translation error. As Adolfo Jayme commented, it is exactly the same for Spanish, but the Spanish translation team seems to be more open and proactive in their case. 

We have the same problem problem with "AutoCorrection" being used instead of Correction automatique. Moreover in "AutoCorrection" the capital C in the middle of the word is a typographical aberration.

It is highly unprofessional to end such a discussion but just closing the bug report.

Best regards
Comment 9 Xisco Faulí 2017-09-30 07:56:28 UTC
You can't confirm your own bugs. Moving it back to UNCONFIRMED until someone else confirms it.
Comment 10 sophie 2017-10-02 08:48:34 UTC
I'm closing this bug as both Jean-Baptiste and me (FR l10n team) agree on the right translation - Sophie