Bug 113426 - Need more case-focused descriptions and "repair" suggestions for working with multi-level lists
Summary: Need more case-focused descriptions and "repair" suggestions for working with...
Status: NEW
Alias: None
Product: LibreOffice
Classification: Unclassified
Component: Documentation (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
6.0.0.0.alpha0+
Hardware: All Linux (All)
: medium enhancement
Assignee: Not Assigned
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks: Bullet-Number-Outline-Lists Help-Changes-Features
  Show dependency treegraph
 
Reported: 2017-10-25 01:20 UTC by Jim Avera
Modified: 2021-05-01 10:21 UTC (History)
3 users (show)

See Also:
Crash report or crash signature:


Attachments
Example .odt document setting up the problem (13.58 KB, application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.text)
2017-10-25 01:20 UTC, Jim Avera
Details

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Description Jim Avera 2017-10-25 01:20:08 UTC
Created attachment 137268 [details]
Example .odt document setting up the problem

With automatic numbering enabled, at a not-first numbered paragraph, then if "Toggle Bulleted" is pressed, it seems impossible to ever resume the numbering sequence.

This might be "user error", though.   If so, perhaps the documentation could say something about this case.

Please see the attached example document.

STEPS TO REPRODUCE:

1. Open new empty writer document

2. Tools->Autocorrect->AutocorrectOptions
   Check (on) "Bulleted and numbered lists. Bullet symbol: *"
   OK

3. Type "1) something... <Enter>" and the next paragraph is automatically numbered with 2). Repeat, to get to "3)"

4. Press the "Toggle Bulleted List" button (in the format toolbar).  The 3) changes to an indented bullet.  Type text and <Enter> a few times.  Indented bulleted paragraphs appear.

5. Attempt to get back out and create top-level 4) paragraph.  Not possible(?)
   Rightclick->Promote One Level is not available
   Clicking "Toggle Bulleted List" removes the bullet but gives no number
   Clicking "Toggle Numbered List" replaced bullet with 1), not 4)

The attached small example sets up the condition.  Thanks.
Comment 1 Regina Henschel 2017-10-25 09:57:45 UTC
If you want to have alternating lists like
  list A
  list A
  list B
  list A
  list B
  list B
  list A
that is possible with the named lists, which you get, when using a numbering style.

If you want one list with different kind of numbering for different levels like
 1) klö
 2) jkl
    * köj
    * wer
    * iip
 3) sfg
 4) jad
then the way you try it is wrong. Using the "Bullet list" item generates a new list and is therefore wrong.
If you are inside the list, you get a list toolbar above the status bar (if not open the "Bullet and Numbering" toolbar via menu View > Toolbars). This toolbar has arrow icons to change the level of a list item. And its rightmost icon opens the dialog to change the kind of numbering.

There exists further ways to handle such changes by selecting the list items and using tab key. That is described in the build-in help.

This is clearly an user error. You can use forum or mailing list to get assistance in using LibreOffice.

Nevertheless, handling of lists is a difficult topic. Therefore I set this as enhancement request for documentation, to get more uses case focused descriptions and "repair" suggestions.
Comment 2 Jim Avera 2017-10-25 18:21:21 UTC
Regina, thank you for the clarification.  I understand now that the full "Bullets and Numbering" dialog can be used to change a paragraph between numbered and bullets without loosing the outline level.

However, I am still confused by the behavior of the "Toggle Bulleted List" button in the Format toolbar.   It does not seem to actually "toggle" anything, because if the user clicks it twice, the original state is not restored.  Instead, the paragraph is forced to the outer level with no numbers or bullets.

Importantly, if the user is deep in a multi-level outline, and presses "Toggle Bulleted List", then the current paragraph changes to bullets and *stays at that level* in the hierarchy (i.e. it's indent level remains the same).  IMO this is appropriate and intuitive.   However it is a trap, because at that point there is no obvious way to continue an outer level.  If so, this is a bug which should be remedied somehow.   Suggestions:

Perhaps the "Toggle Bulleted List/Numbering" buttons in the format toolbar can be made to actually toggle state.  This implies saving both numbering and bullet selections somewhere so you can switch between them with a "Toggle" action.

Alternatively, disable (gray) out the "Toggle" buttons whenever the user would be trapped by pressing them.  For example, when the current paragraph is in a deeper-than-top-level list, prevent the user from pressing "Toggle Bulleted Liist" (because if they do they will destroy their outline, i.e. be unable to return to outer levels).
Comment 3 Justin L 2021-05-01 10:21:26 UTC
One REALLY need to use numbering styles instead of a toolbar toggle to get understandable results. The toolbar is only good for simplistic users.