Download it now!
Bug 132066 - UI: Don't translate the vulkan/raster specifier in about window
Summary: UI: Don't translate the vulkan/raster specifier in about window
Status: RESOLVED FIXED
Alias: None
Product: LibreOffice
Classification: Unclassified
Component: LibreOffice (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
7.0.0.0.alpha0+
Hardware: All All
: medium normal
Assignee: Not Assigned
URL:
Whiteboard: target:7.1.0 target:7.0.1
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks: About-Dialog
  Show dependency treegraph
 
Reported: 2020-04-12 14:27 UTC by Telesto
Modified: 2020-07-31 21:09 UTC (History)
10 users (show)

See Also:
Crash report or crash signature:


Attachments

Note You need to log in before you can comment on or make changes to this bug.
Description Telesto 2020-04-12 14:27:56 UTC
Description:
The about info is often added to bug info. It's 'fully' translated I noticed. Most of the info can be distilled (even when translated), except for Raster/Vulkan. 

Not translating the About Window could also be considered, IMHO. It quite in consistent: mixing Cyrillic and Latin for example.

Steps to Reproduce:
1. Help -> About in a foreign language 

Actual Results:
Версия: 7.0.0.0.alpha0+ (x64)
ID сборки: b0b9d736fb9ed73e849f80800916466868dbce28
Потоков ЦП: 4; ОС: Windows 10.0 Build 18363; Отрисовка ИП: Skia/растр; VCL: win; 
Локаль: ru-RU (ru_RU); Язык интерфейса: ru-RU
Calc: threaded

Expected Results:
English please... At the minimum the Skia raster/vulkan description. 



Reproducible: Always


User Profile Reset: No



Additional Info:
-
Comment 1 Julien Nabet 2020-04-12 15:31:40 UTC
Luboš: I noticed the commit https://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/core/commit/?id=48c92ecb2ee04a25fd14f818b1fb7d752cde58c1, do we want/need the 2 strings translatable?
Comment 2 Luboš Luňák 2020-04-14 10:22:56 UTC
Everything in that dialog is marked for translation. I see no good reason to avoid doing that just for Skia/Vulkan.
Comment 3 Telesto 2020-04-14 10:40:24 UTC
(In reply to Luboš Luňák from comment #2)
> Everything in that dialog is marked for translation. I see no good reason to
> avoid doing that just for Skia/Vulkan.

I can't read Russian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. It's essential to know if it's Skia Raster or Vulkan. It makes QA unnecessary hard
Comment 4 Luboš Luňák 2020-04-14 11:04:10 UTC
(In reply to Telesto from comment #3)
> I can't read Russian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. It's essential to know if it's
> Skia Raster or Vulkan. It makes QA unnecessary hard

All I am saying is that Skia is not special here. If there is a problem with "Skia/Vulkan", then presumably there is also a problem with "gen", "threaded" or "default".
Comment 5 Telesto 2020-04-14 13:48:46 UTC
(In reply to Luboš Luňák from comment #4)
> (In reply to Telesto from comment #3)
> > I can't read Russian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. It's essential to know if it's
> > Skia Raster or Vulkan. It makes QA unnecessary hard
> 
> All I am saying is that Skia is not special here. If there is a problem with
> "Skia/Vulkan", then presumably there is also a problem with "gen",
> "threaded" or "default".

A, sorry for the noise. Yes, you're correct "threaded" or "default" are also translated.

The (Dutch) translation is also mix of Dutch/English (probably because of lacking equivalents [or incomplete translation?]. And confusing too. Calc: CL

These view lines in about containing the technical information should be translated at all. Adding the UX-department to the loop.

[There must be objections in the area of  GUI translation consistency etc etc.]
Comment 6 Adolfo Jayme 2020-04-14 19:54:56 UTC
If QA has a problem with localization, they should deal with that, not pass the ball to users of the program, who will in turn blame localizers for not delivering a full UI translation.

We already do not translate (or transliterate, in the case of Cyrillic-written languages) proper names such as Vulkan or Skia. I don’t see the issue here.
Comment 7 Roman Kuznetsov 2020-04-14 20:17:17 UTC
I agree with Telesto here, don't need to translate any system info in About dialog.

And Luboš in Comment 4 is right
Comment 8 Ming Hua 2020-04-14 20:32:15 UTC
I don't think this issue is as black-and-white as some of the comments portray it.  I believe whether this information should be translated depends on the intended audience, is it the end user, or the QA people and developers?

It's hard to argue against that end users want to read the version number.

It's also hard to deny that OS, VCL, and Calc fields are mainly for QA/devs.
Comment 9 Telesto 2020-04-15 18:03:35 UTC
A possible solution would be an some-sort of 'overlay'. Show localized, but copy English (not sure if this doable). Or is this inconsistent UI behavior. Can't deny a 'surprise' effect.
Comment 10 Heiko Tietze 2020-04-17 14:14:44 UTC
(In reply to Telesto from comment #9)
> A possible solution would be an some-sort of 'overlay'. Show localized, but
> copy English (not sure if this doable). Or is this inconsistent UI behavior.
> Can't deny a 'surprise' effect.

Strings are localized when copied, might be difficult to get the English originals. To support both users and QA we could translate the label but not the variables. Like "нарезной: Yes" (not sure this is the correct translation for "threaded").

Sophie, what do you think?
Comment 11 sophie 2020-04-17 14:27:48 UTC
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #10)
> (In reply to Telesto from comment #9)
> > A possible solution would be an some-sort of 'overlay'. Show localized, but
> > copy English (not sure if this doable). Or is this inconsistent UI behavior.
> > Can't deny a 'surprise' effect.
> 
> Strings are localized when copied, might be difficult to get the English
> originals. To support both users and QA we could translate the label but not
> the variables. Like "нарезной: Yes" (not sure this is the correct
> translation for "threaded").
> 
> Sophie, what do you think?

I agree, that's a good compromise, make only the labels translatable.
Comment 12 Roman Kuznetsov 2020-04-17 14:47:58 UTC
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #10)
> (In reply to Telesto from comment #9)
> > A possible solution would be an some-sort of 'overlay'. Show localized, but
> > copy English (not sure if this doable). Or is this inconsistent UI behavior.
> > Can't deny a 'surprise' effect.
> 
> Strings are localized when copied, might be difficult to get the English
> originals. To support both users and QA we could translate the label but not
> the variables. Like "нарезной: Yes" (not sure this is the correct
> translation for "threaded").
> 
> Sophie, what do you think?

I disagree. 

This in EN

Version: 7.0.0.0.alpha0+
Build ID: 6c59c9d2b8818674640a50656ffba90f9cd3900e
CPU threads: 4; OS: Mac OS X 10.15.4; UI render: default; VCL: osx; 
Locale: ru-RU (ru_RU.UTF-8); UI-Language: en-US
Calc: threaded

will become in RU

Версия: 7.0.0.0.alpha0+
Номер сбрки: 6c59c9d2b8818674640a50656ffba90f9cd3900e
Потоки процессора: 4; ОС: Mac OS X 10.15.4; Отрисовка интерфейса: default; VCL: osx; 
Локаль: ru-RU (ru_RU.UTF-8); Язык интерфейса: en-US
Calc: threaded

and it looks strange for both EN and RU speakers

Let's leave these five strings without translating at all.
Comment 13 Telesto 2020-04-17 16:04:58 UTC
I'm agreeing with Roman. And the compromise (comment 10) off:
* Unpractical: I'm still not aware what the meaning is of "нарезной: Yes"; 
* It's still inconsistent: why should 'yes' show up in English. It has to be translated too: 'ja' (dutch)
* The translation of the About screen is inconsistent. It contains English words in many languages. DE/NL/FR/RU/Persian. If the language finds is necessary to 'translate' the about screen, do it properly. Invent new words, if localized equivalents are lacking... And translate version numbers too (including for artwork; we want to be consistent)
* We a talking about 5 lines 

I would even consider to not translate the 'See log' + clickable link. It points to an English page. The Dutch translation "Zie log". And log is a Dutch word, not in the given context. Maybe 'logboek'. But maybe a Dutch localization issue.

* The bug tracker isn't localized either
* The application names aren't translated. I'm having shortcuts to Writer, Calc, Draw, Impress, Math. Mystery to me!

Btw, not intending to offend all the localization departments. Truly translating everything can be really hard. But I can get a bit sarcastic/harsh, of the 'ideal' maybe a full localization, while it's nearly impossible. QA English, DEV departement English, wiki.documentfoundation.org English (except for some pages), programming language is English. 

And also more English terms are sneaking into different languages (www; http; ssl). So maybe accept not everything needs, or can be localized.

Point everybody with complains here..
Comment 14 sophie 2020-04-20 07:41:07 UTC
(In reply to Roman Kuznetsov from comment #12)
> (In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #10)
> > (In reply to Telesto from comment #9)
> > > A possible solution would be an some-sort of 'overlay'. Show localized, but
> > > copy English (not sure if this doable). Or is this inconsistent UI behavior.
> > > Can't deny a 'surprise' effect.
> > 
> > Strings are localized when copied, might be difficult to get the English
> > originals. To support both users and QA we could translate the label but not
> > the variables. Like "нарезной: Yes" (not sure this is the correct
> > translation for "threaded").
> > 
> > Sophie, what do you think?
> 
> I disagree. 
> 
> This in EN
> 
> Version: 7.0.0.0.alpha0+
> Build ID: 6c59c9d2b8818674640a50656ffba90f9cd3900e
> CPU threads: 4; OS: Mac OS X 10.15.4; UI render: default; VCL: osx; 
> Locale: ru-RU (ru_RU.UTF-8); UI-Language: en-US
> Calc: threaded
> 
> will become in RU
> 
> Версия: 7.0.0.0.alpha0+
> Номер сбрки: 6c59c9d2b8818674640a50656ffba90f9cd3900e
> Потоки процессора: 4; ОС: Mac OS X 10.15.4; Отрисовка интерфейса: default;
> VCL: osx; 
> Локаль: ru-RU (ru_RU.UTF-8); Язык интерфейса: en-US
> Calc: threaded
> 
> and it looks strange for both EN and RU speakers
> 
> Let's leave these five strings without translating at all.

(In reply to Telesto from comment #13)
> I'm agreeing with Roman. And the compromise (comment 10) off:
> * Unpractical: I'm still not aware what the meaning is of "нарезной: Yes"; 
> * It's still inconsistent: why should 'yes' show up in English. It has to be
> translated too: 'ja' (dutch)
> * The translation of the About screen is inconsistent. It contains English
> words in many languages. DE/NL/FR/RU/Persian. If the language finds is
> necessary to 'translate' the about screen, do it properly. Invent new words,
> if localized equivalents are lacking... And translate version numbers too
> (including for artwork; we want to be consistent)
> * We a talking about 5 lines 
> 
> I would even consider to not translate the 'See log' + clickable link. It
> points to an English page. The Dutch translation "Zie log". And log is a
> Dutch word, not in the given context. Maybe 'logboek'. But maybe a Dutch
> localization issue.
> 
> * The bug tracker isn't localized either
> * The application names aren't translated. I'm having shortcuts to Writer,
> Calc, Draw, Impress, Math. Mystery to me!
> 
> Btw, not intending to offend all the localization departments. Truly
> translating everything can be really hard. But I can get a bit
> sarcastic/harsh, of the 'ideal' maybe a full localization, while it's nearly
> impossible. QA English, DEV departement English, wiki.documentfoundation.org
> English (except for some pages), programming language is English. 
> 
> And also more English terms are sneaking into different languages (www;
> http; ssl). So maybe accept not everything needs, or can be localized.
> 
> Point everybody with complains here..

Then let it have localized and up to localization teams. It is not acceptable to have English words in localized UI. My proposal was a brake to the rules to find a comprise, I understand it's not good however. 
Names of the modules are considered not translatable since their creation, it's a trademark. Names of protocols (like http) and standards should not be localized either. And I don't see why SKIA or VCL or any library's name should be localized (but here it's my own take).
So sorry for QA, but if you need those strings in English, then change the way to retrieve them in the software. It's not a localization issue.
Comment 15 Luboš Luňák 2020-04-20 08:56:57 UTC
Apparently master has changed the UI there and now the dialog doesn't provide any info whatsoever except for the version. If that's really intended, maybe a good solution would be to have another entry in the 'Help' menu that would provide just system info, untranslated?
Comment 16 Buovjaga 2020-04-20 09:11:29 UTC
(In reply to Luboš Luňák from comment #15)
> Apparently master has changed the UI there and now the dialog doesn't
> provide any info whatsoever except for the version. If that's really
> intended, maybe a good solution would be to have another entry in the 'Help'
> menu that would provide just system info, untranslated?

I assume you are seeing bug 132181
Comment 17 Heiko Tietze 2020-04-20 10:02:12 UTC
(In reply to sophie from comment #14)
> Then let it have localized and up to localization teams. It is not
> acceptable to have English words in localized UI.

Removing UX as this l10n statement has priority. The new dialog will have a button "Copy Version Info" and we have to make this working for QA not the UI.
Comment 18 Heiko Tietze 2020-04-29 09:49:41 UTC
Patch https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/c/core/+/93119 solves the issue partially. Remaining localized pieces are RID_SVXSTR_ABOUT_UILOCALE ("UI-Language") and all content after "CPU threads" 

#define SV_APP_CPUTHREADS                            NC_("SV_APP_CPUTHREADS", "CPU threads: ")
#define SV_APP_OSVERSION                             NC_("SV_APP_OSVERSION", "OS: ")
#define SV_APP_UIRENDER                              NC_("SV_APP_UIRENDER", "UI render: ")
#define SV_APP_GL                                    NC_("SV_APP_GL", "GL")
#define SV_APP_SKIA_VULKAN                           NC_("SV_APP_SKIA_VULKAN", "Skia/Vulkan")
#define SV_APP_SKIA_RASTER                           NC_("SV_APP_SKIA_RASTER", "Skia/Raster")
#define SV_APP_DEFAULT                               NC_("SV_APP_DEFAULT", "default")

But I would resolve the ticket as fixed if the patch succeeds CI. Hard to believe that l10n translates these strings. Otherwise back to discussion.
Comment 19 Heiko Tietze 2020-05-05 05:56:28 UTC
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #18)
> But I would resolve the ticket as fixed if the patch succeeds CI.

No further opinion so doing it.
Comment 20 Mike Kaganski 2020-07-07 20:20:13 UTC
Couldn't it all be easily made correctly translated in GUI, and correctly English in clipboard, just by using a variant of current CuiResId, like this:


OUString CuiResId_En_US(const char *pKey)
{
    return Translate::get(pKey, Translate::Create("cui", "en-US"));
}

and using that to construct the data copied to clipboard, in the same way that normal CuiResId would be used to populate the dialog?
Comment 21 Commit Notification 2020-07-28 21:30:22 UTC
Heiko Tietze committed a patch related to this issue.
It has been pushed to "master":

https://git.libreoffice.org/core/commit/b4b8665bd370a869196e2f63acc2cdde7a37a4df

Resolves tdf#132066 - Localization of special text in about window

It will be available in 7.1.0.

The patch should be included in the daily builds available at
https://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/ in the next 24-48 hours. More
information about daily builds can be found at:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Testing_Daily_Builds

Affected users are encouraged to test the fix and report feedback.
Comment 22 Commit Notification 2020-07-29 01:18:15 UTC
Heiko Tietze committed a patch related to this issue.
It has been pushed to "libreoffice-7-0":

https://git.libreoffice.org/core/commit/5863e5a06069a005023f97013ffd170f121d3f8a

Resolves tdf#132066 - Localization of special text in about window

It will be available in 7.0.1.

The patch should be included in the daily builds available at
https://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/ in the next 24-48 hours. More
information about daily builds can be found at:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Testing_Daily_Builds

Affected users are encouraged to test the fix and report feedback.
Comment 23 Commit Notification 2020-07-31 21:09:57 UTC
Heiko Tietze committed a patch related to this issue.
It has been pushed to "master":

https://git.libreoffice.org/core/commit/3abc852f2f582b3abdd082b274ceeea67b21a0ab

Resolves tdf#132066 - Localization of special text in about window

It will be available in 7.1.0.

The patch should be included in the daily builds available at
https://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/ in the next 24-48 hours. More
information about daily builds can be found at:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Testing_Daily_Builds

Affected users are encouraged to test the fix and report feedback.