Bug 151394 - Better UX to insert and manage playing an audio stream/soundtrack in background for entire ODF presentation
Summary: Better UX to insert and manage playing an audio stream/soundtrack in backgrou...
Status: NEW
Alias: None
Product: LibreOffice
Classification: Unclassified
Component: Impress (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
7.3.6.2 release
Hardware: All All
: medium enhancement
Assignee: Not Assigned
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks: Media-Playback
  Show dependency treegraph
 
Reported: 2022-10-06 18:02 UTC by Randy
Modified: 2022-11-10 14:27 UTC (History)
4 users (show)

See Also:
Crash report or crash signature:


Attachments
Presentation with audio background play (20.41 KB, application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.presentation)
2022-10-07 16:54 UTC, Rainer Bielefeld Retired
Details
content.xml from sample file (27.66 KB, text/xml)
2022-10-07 17:55 UTC, Rainer Bielefeld Retired
Details
Test kit ... (1.86 MB, application/x-zip-compressed)
2022-10-08 06:42 UTC, Rainer Bielefeld Retired
Details

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Description Randy 2022-10-06 18:02:46 UTC
Description:
There are two feature suggestions that would benefit Impress.  One is being able to add audio files that play across the entire or a portion of the presentation.  

Also, being able to export a presentation as a video would be very beneficial.  

Actual Results:
Inserted audio plays only where it is inserted

Expected Results:
Inserted audio played across all or multiple slides.


Reproducible: Always


User Profile Reset: No



Additional Info:
Spent a great deal of time creating a presentation anticipating these features.  Hopefully this is something that can be added relatively easily.
Comment 1 V Stuart Foote 2022-10-07 02:44:53 UTC
OK, can see it as useful. But would probably need some control of the media playback as in see also.

But the second is already possible, sort of with export to SVG based "SMIL2.0" format  (see bug 117708) . But a full video encoding e.g. to mp4 is better left to external capture programs.

Onto the UX-advise pile...
Comment 2 Heiko Tietze 2022-10-07 08:10:50 UTC
Assuming an advertising use case (shown in a loop with no personal presence) where a narrator explains what is shown on the slides. Or what is your use case? => NEEDINFO

What we need is a media properties dialog that allows to set "[ ] Do not stop on next slide" among other options (currently we have a sidebar deck at the properties tab). 

I wonder what happens when you go back to the previous slide, however. Guess we should stop. And what if another media file starts on the next slide, mix both or stop the first.
Comment 3 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-07 08:16:37 UTC
I already created animations some time ago (2011or so) with one music background all over the presentation. It will take a moment until I will remember how I did ...
Comment 4 Randy 2022-10-07 13:27:09 UTC
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #1)
> OK, can see it as useful. But would probably need some control of the media
> playback as in see also.
> 
> But the second is already possible, sort of with export to SVG based
> "SMIL2.0" format  (see bug 117708) . But a full video encoding e.g. to mp4
> is better left to external capture programs.
> 
> Onto the UX-advise pile...

Thanks for that tip on the SVG.  I wasn't familiar with that format.  That did work for running in a browser however, converting that to a video file is a little more difficult.  There are plenty of options for converting to SVG, even .mp4 to SVG but not the other way around (at least that I could find).
Comment 5 Randy 2022-10-07 13:35:42 UTC
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #2)
> Assuming an advertising use case (shown in a loop with no personal presence)
> where a narrator explains what is shown on the slides. Or what is your use
> case? => NEEDINFO
> 
> What we need is a media properties dialog that allows to set "[ ] Do not
> stop on next slide" among other options (currently we have a sidebar deck at
> the properties tab). 
> 
> I wonder what happens when you go back to the previous slide, however. Guess
> we should stop. And what if another media file starts on the next slide, mix
> both or stop the first.

In my use, I am creating an automatic run slides show - each of the slides has it's own amount of time and it begins to run as soon as you start the show.  This type of slideshow (whether uniform slide times or individual slide times) works great for events like memorial services or graduation parties where you may want to run a slideshow of images either as a one time show as a presentation or looped to run on a monitor throughout the event.  For longer slideshows that last 5 to 10 minutes, it would be nice to be able to string a couple audio files to play in the background with maybe the ability to fade out the audio at the end of the slideshow if the audio file is longer than the amount of images.
Comment 6 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-07 16:54:50 UTC
Created attachment 182906 [details]
Presentation with audio background play

This is a Presentation I created in 2011 with background Music. Starts with Sheet 1. Music is related to sheet, if I delete it music will not play.
Deleting sheets 3,5,7 will not delete any Music, will not cause Music hickups.

I can't find out how I did that ...
Comment 7 Randy 2022-10-07 17:18:25 UTC
I downloaded that attachment but there was no music file attached and the sheets were mostly blank.  It was only 21kb in size.  I did figure out how to use the xbox game bar to screen record the presentation as it played.  That produced an .mp4 video file.  I then added the audio track I wanted to that file.  A lot of steps that could be potentially all handled by Impress I think.
Comment 8 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-07 17:55:19 UTC
Created attachment 182908 [details]
content.xml from sample file

(In reply to Randy from comment #7)
No! The music simply comes from a linked file.

Here as att. you see content.xml from unzipped presentation.
Search in it for "Hartford" and you will find 2 relative links to the 
background music .mp3.

An expert might be able to find out how that works from the source  file

Also ASK and OOo forum and so on are full of hints how to get a background music for all presentation, but I can't think straight enough at the moment to understand what they tell me
Comment 9 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-08 06:42:23 UTC
Created attachment 182911 [details]
Test kit ...

There is no bug – except insufficient Help Text, may be
Attached sample presentation and background music, Created with LibI 7.5 (Version doesn't matter). 
1. Download .zip
2. unzip
3. open .odp
4. Run Presentation
   >> background music plays "Stratosphere" by Kevin MacLeod plays on and on

How to create such a presentation:
11. Create your presentation as usual and finally:
12. Select Slide where music should start to play (first slide)
13. <f11> for 'Styles and Formatting' sidebar
   » Sidebar appears
14. Click Slide Transition Icon in Sidebar (or press <ctrl+Alt+6>)
   » Transition effects appear
15. Below Heading 'Modify Transition' ˋSound Dropdown → Other Sound ...
    Browse for a sound and select it  → Check 'loop until next sound'ˊ
16. <f5> to launch presentation
   » Presentation starts, music plays on and on, slide change has no influence.

So I think we don't have a bug here. And Checkmark does not need more explication. The only thing you need to mention is that you must not press [Apply transition to All Slides] afterwards. That would destroy continuous music play
Comment 10 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-08 06:43:02 UTC
Comment on attachment 182906 [details]
Presentation with audio background play

Obsolete!
Comment 11 Rainer Bielefeld Retired 2022-10-08 06:56:16 UTC
No obvious DUP found with query <https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=dorem&remaction=run&namedcmd=DUPs151394&sharer_id=19321>. Except – may be – "Bug 99793 - the sound starts again with each new slide". But I have some problems to understand the resolution there.

And I can't see any relation to "Bug 132793 - Impress: add control to play audio from slides". That's an IMPORT PPTX Problem?!
Comment 12 Heiko Tietze 2022-10-10 09:00:40 UTC
Randy, do you think the slide transition sound is appropriate to your task - and just some documentation is missing - or would it be an abuse for your use case?
Comment 13 Randy 2022-10-10 15:54:15 UTC
(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #12)
> Randy, do you think the slide transition sound is appropriate to your task -
> and just some documentation is missing - or would it be an abuse for your
> use case?
The audio resets with each successive slide transition.  I am trying to have an audio track(s) play continuously throughout the slide presentation.  Say I am doing a 50th anniversary picture collage at a dinner event.  With Impress you can easily add the pictures and set a 5 second time for each photo and have it run automatically, however, there is no option to add background music to that presentation.  The slide transition feature is what happens between each slide, thus any audio track used as a slide transition stops and then restarts with each successive slide.
Comment 14 Randy 2022-10-10 15:57:04 UTC
I see the status for this bug has been set to "resolved" "invalid".  What does that mean exactly?  None of the comments as far as I was able to discern supplied a working solution to being able to add audio as background throughout the slideshow.
Comment 15 V Stuart Foote 2022-10-10 17:25:08 UTC
Yes, the effect is available and functions pretty well. But the UI needs some effort. This is not an Invalid *enhancement* request.

From the 7.3 Impress guide, pg 275
<quote>
Playing music
Music can be played during a slide show instead of a sound as a transition effect. When using music in a slide show, make sure any musical copyright or licensing for the music is not being infringed.

1) Click on Slide Transition in the Sidebar to open the Slide Transition deck.
2) Open the presentation file to add slide transitions.
3) In the Slides pane or Slide Sorter view, select the slide where music is going to be added as part of the slide transition. 
4) In Modify Transition, select Other sound from the Sound drop-down list.
5) In the file browser window that opens, navigate to where the music file is located and select the music file required. 
6) Click on Play to check if the music file is suitable.
7) If the music is suitable, click Open to add the music to the selected slide and close the file browser window.
8) To play a music file continuously in the slide show, select Loop until next sound in Modify Transition. The music file restarts once it is finished until the next music file that is inserted in the slide show.

Note
Do not select the Apply Transition to All Slides option to prevent the selected music file restarting as each slide opens in the presentation.

Note
The music file is linked to a slide show rather than embedded. If the slide show is going to be displayed on a different computer, the music file must be available on the computer where the slide show is going to be displayed and the link to the music file must be established before starting the slide show.
</quote>

=-=-=-

But, some major UX issues around usage and discoverability probably needs documentation guidance of the workflow.

1. slide advance and transition/effect if any for the entire slide deck must be finalized *before* applying the sound as last edit(s). Which should *not* then be "Applied to all slides".

2. Can only be applied to the first slide of a sequence from  SB "Slide Transition" deck (or entered from main menu "Slide" menu -> "Slide Transition") using the Modify Transition content panel. Then setting the 'Loop until next sound' checkbox. The transition can be blank, and only the 'Sound' -> 'Other sound...' is used to select the audio file to play.

3. To loop, Presentation mode (main menu 'Slide Show' -> 'Slide Show Settings...') must be set to 'Loop and repeat after:' some value in hr:min:sec.

4. the loop after pause is treated as a "next sound" and the audio restarts--so the music/audio file would need to be trimmed externally to match the slide show duration.

5. the audio file is *not* embedded into the ODF presentation, just file system reference recorded as a "<presentation:sound xlink:href=" entry in content.xml; so the audio will have to be provided as an external file with the ODF archive.
Comment 16 Randy 2022-10-10 17:55:03 UTC
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #15)
> Yes, the effect is available and functions pretty well. But the UI needs
> some effort. This is not an Invalid *enhancement* request.
> 
> From the 7.3 Impress guide, pg 275
> <quote>
> Playing music
> Music can be played during a slide show instead of a sound as a transition
> effect. When using music in a slide show, make sure any musical copyright or
> licensing for the music is not being infringed.
> 
> 1) Click on Slide Transition in the Sidebar to open the Slide Transition
> deck.
> 2) Open the presentation file to add slide transitions.
> 3) In the Slides pane or Slide Sorter view, select the slide where music is
> going to be added as part of the slide transition. 
> 4) In Modify Transition, select Other sound from the Sound drop-down list.
> 5) In the file browser window that opens, navigate to where the music file
> is located and select the music file required. 
> 6) Click on Play to check if the music file is suitable.
> 7) If the music is suitable, click Open to add the music to the selected
> slide and close the file browser window.
> 8) To play a music file continuously in the slide show, select Loop until
> next sound in Modify Transition. The music file restarts once it is finished
> until the next music file that is inserted in the slide show.
> 
> Note
> Do not select the Apply Transition to All Slides option to prevent the
> selected music file restarting as each slide opens in the presentation.
> 
> Note
> The music file is linked to a slide show rather than embedded. If the slide
> show is going to be displayed on a different computer, the music file must
> be available on the computer where the slide show is going to be displayed
> and the link to the music file must be established before starting the slide
> show.
> </quote>
> 
> =-=-=-
> 
> But, some major UX issues around usage and discoverability probably needs
> documentation guidance of the workflow.
> 
> 1. slide advance and transition/effect if any for the entire slide deck must
> be finalized *before* applying the sound as last edit(s). Which should *not*
> then be "Applied to all slides".
> 
> 2. Can only be applied to the first slide of a sequence from  SB "Slide
> Transition" deck (or entered from main menu "Slide" menu -> "Slide
> Transition") using the Modify Transition content panel. Then setting the
> 'Loop until next sound' checkbox. The transition can be blank, and only the
> 'Sound' -> 'Other sound...' is used to select the audio file to play.
> 
> 3. To loop, Presentation mode (main menu 'Slide Show' -> 'Slide Show
> Settings...') must be set to 'Loop and repeat after:' some value in
> hr:min:sec.
> 
> 4. the loop after pause is treated as a "next sound" and the audio
> restarts--so the music/audio file would need to be trimmed externally to
> match the slide show duration.
> 
> 5. the audio file is *not* embedded into the ODF presentation, just file
> system reference recorded as a "<presentation:sound xlink:href=" entry in
> content.xml; so the audio will have to be provided as an external file with
> the ODF archive.

Thanks for the clarification.  I think when I tried that previously I thought it wasn't working because i was trying to preview it with the play button in the slide transition sidebar.  And then I ended up applying to all slides.  I just followed your instructions and it worked as you indicated.  Looking forward to potential enhancements for this feature.
Comment 17 Heiko Tietze 2022-11-10 09:28:51 UTC
The topic was on the agenda of the design meeting but didn't receive further input.

To summarize: 

The workflow is to use slide transition sounds which plays a sample until it ends. The access is clunky and hard to figure out, however, effect must be finalized before applying the sound, must not be "Applied to all slides", can only be applied to the first slide of a sequence, looping needs very precise timing, and audio file is not embedded into the ODF presentation.

Two scenarios come in mind: a) "control" the presentation via audio and continue to the next slide when the sample has ended, and b) play and loop the background music until a certain point.

So we need to introduce an extra dialog/interaction, that allows to start, stop, and loop playback. It should be combined with the effort to embed samples in the presentation.
Comment 18 Randy 2022-11-10 14:26:48 UTC
This might be bad form :-) but I revisited Powerpoint 2010 to see how they incorporated music.  They have the transition option, but that is music played per slide - really for a transition.  Their method is to use the insert function - where you would insert a table, picture, clip art, shape text box, etc.  Inserting a video and audio are also option there.  Once you click on the insert audio (after selecting the appropriate audio file or clip art audio) there is an audio icon attached to that slide (which can be hidden throughout the slideshow).  There are playback controls for that item such as trim audio (set start and stop points), fade in and fade out, volume options, start options (automatically, on click, or play across slides).  There are also loop until stopped and rewind after playing options.  I recall seeing powerpoint presentations where there were enough photos in the show that an audio item was inserted into the first slide which played for the set time across a matching number of timed photos and then another audio item was inserted in the subsequent slide to play through the remaining photos.  
I hope that is helpful in considering how this could be implemented in Presentation
Comment 19 Randy 2022-11-10 14:27:09 UTC Comment hidden (obsolete)