Bug 98259 (Shortcuts-Accelerators) - [META] Keyboard shortcuts and accelerators bugs and enhancements
Summary: [META] Keyboard shortcuts and accelerators bugs and enhancements
Status: NEW
Alias: Shortcuts-Accelerators
Product: LibreOffice
Classification: Unclassified
Component: LibreOffice (show other bugs)
Version:
(earliest affected)
5.2.0.0.alpha0+
Hardware: All All
: medium normal
Assignee: Not Assigned
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Depends on: 32475 34016 34704 34804 35588 38014 38169 38604 38803 39302 41981 45472 45705 49091 49820 51093 51401 53660 55838 57188 58845 61424 62688 67574 82248 84502 85850 86310 87173 87174 87674 89089 91620 92452 92453 95635 95854 96039 96292 97511 98255 98290 98333 98374 98375 98404 100626 100784 102307 102313 106785 Shortcuts-Locale Shortcuts-AltGR 107281 107282 107346 107393 107588 107994 112932 113220 113741 113939 34564 44417 51402 59418 59920 69550 80364 86486 92516 92630 92866 94865 96022 96969 97906 98167 98286 98288 99280 99493 99595 100436 100765 100851 100859 101417 101951 102053 103084 104372 105447 105990 106071 106562 107426 107455 108962 111800 112110
Blocks:
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Reported: 2016-02-28 22:58 UTC by Yousuf Philips (jay)
Modified: 2017-11-21 12:03 UTC (History)
5 users (show)

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Description Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-02-28 22:58:19 UTC
I'm expecting there will be a number of related bug reports on improving Calc's keyboard shortcuts.
Comment 1 Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-03-02 22:51:25 UTC
Lets expand this to shortcuts in all modules.
Comment 2 Óvári 2016-03-03 06:56:39 UTC
Depends on:
Bug 71176 - Shortcut keys for accented Latin characters
Bug 92452 - Entire row functionality in formulae keyboard shortcuts
Bug 92453 - Entire column functionality in formulae keyboard shortcuts
Bug 96981 - After starting formula in Sheet1, we are unable to select all cells in Sheet2 with the row and column heading corner
Bug 97548 - Ctrl is incorrectly behaving like Shift
Bug 93936 - Creating a formula using Ctrl can incorrectly append a comma at the beginning of the function argument
Comment 3 Björn Michaelsen 2016-03-22 01:26:53 UTC Comment hidden (off-topic)
Comment 4 Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-03-22 11:30:18 UTC Comment hidden (off-topic)
Comment 5 riesslibo 2016-04-22 11:42:55 UTC
As expected in the description ;-)

For information: In German UI/local QUERZ Win7 the shortcut Crtl+Shift+: works fine for Timestamp like Excel, shortcut Crtl+. does not work, nothing happens. 

Thanks for the work on this issue
Lothar
Comment 6 V Stuart Foote 2016-06-27 14:32:59 UTC
adding 
bug 92516 -- "x" accelerator and mouse click not exiting StartCenter in "File -> Exit LibreOfficeDev" menu
bug 92866 -- Keyboard command shortcuts don't work in start center
bug 97511 -- Handling of Q_MOD1 <Ctrl>+Q in menus -- not functional from OOo
bug 100626 -- From an initial LO Start Center session-- creating new Writer document doesn't result in edit focus to the canvas of the new document -- N_MOD1
Comment 7 Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-07-08 07:21:46 UTC
(In reply to riesslibo from comment #5)
> For information: In German UI/local QUERZ Win7 the shortcut Crtl+Shift+:
> works fine for Timestamp like Excel, shortcut Crtl+. does not work, nothing
> happens. 

Hi Lothar,

Please report this as a bug and add the bug number to the depends on field in this meta bug.
Comment 8 mahfiaz 2016-08-10 06:31:36 UTC
Bug 101417 - Alt accelerators in menus not unique (Calc, probably others)
Comment 9 HansPL 2016-10-12 09:48:29 UTC
What really drives me crazy with LO:  that every new release changes quite a lot of keyboard shortcuts / alt/meta accelerators in all kinds of menus!  Without any obvious need, and often creating collisions.  (Using German l10n)

Hey devs:  how would you like it if your Emacs/Vim/Notepad++/<favorite editor> would change the key sequences every other month you've memorized and use constantly?  Hm?  Imagine that shitstorm…  

Maybe a lot of LO users are mouse-pushers and don't notice this, but there ARE people using key shortcuts.  

Please DO refrain from arbitrarily reassigning all these accelerators with every little UI desing change!
Comment 10 Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-10-12 14:44:41 UTC
(In reply to HansPL from comment #9)
> What really drives me crazy with LO:  that every new release changes quite a
> lot of keyboard shortcuts / alt/meta accelerators in all kinds of menus! 
> Without any obvious need, and often creating collisions.  (Using German l10n)

To my knowledge there hasnt been any massive changes to keyboard shortcuts. As the menus are currently under going quite a bit of changes, unfortunately menu accelerators will also be affected by these changes, primarily to limit having the same accelerator for multiple entries, but I try to limit these changes as much as possible, atleast in english.

> Hey devs:  how would you like it if your Emacs/Vim/Notepad++/<favorite
> editor> would change the key sequences every other month you've memorized
> and use constantly?  Hm?  Imagine that shitstorm…  

You can change the accelerators in Tools > Customize > Menu and then rename the command and add a '~' before the character that should have the accelerator.

> Maybe a lot of LO users are mouse-pushers and don't notice this, but there
> ARE people using key shortcuts.  

We do notice this issue (e.g. bug 94865) and have individuals who volunteer with libreoffice who are accelerator users.

> Please DO refrain from arbitrarily reassigning all these accelerators with
> every little UI desing change!

As stated above we do try as much as possible not to change accelerators as much as possible. If you find any particular accelerator in a menu that you think should be changed back, please file a bug report for it.
Comment 11 HansPL 2016-10-12 21:11:21 UTC
(In reply to Yousuf Philips (jay) from comment #10)
> […] As stated above we do try as much as possible not to change accelerators > as much as possible. 

Sorry, but I do not find this to be true. At least not in my German LO, so this is probably more of an l10n issue.  

Take for instance the context menu (menu key or right mouse button) in Writer, which triggered my above rant:  From 5.1.4.2 to 5.2.2.2  seven out of ten accelerators were changed where there was absolutely no need:  
• Einfügen  from i to n 
• Inhalte einfügen  from I to h 
• Zeichen…  from c to Z 
• Absatz…  from b to t
• Aufzählungszeichen  from u to ä 
• Absatzvorlage  from nothing to e 
• Synonyme  from m to S  
And where could I customize this context menu?  Which is not an option anyway because I use LO in different versions on five different Linux machines (Mint LMDE Mate) plus sometimes on colleague's Windows machines…  

(By the way, in 5.2.2.2 the opened context menu blocks Alt+Print so I cannot take a screenshot of that menu — in 4.3.3.2 and 5.1.4.2 it works.) 

This is just the one of several examples which enraged me this morning.  

Or, for instance the same context menu in Writer inside a table to edit the table's properties:  
• In Writer 4.3.3.2 I typed  Menu Alt+E  for Tabelle… 
• In Writer 5.1.4.2 Einfügen was changed from i to e so it now collided with renamed Tabelleneigenschaften, opening a submenu, forcing me to  Menu Alt+E Left Alt+E. 
• In Writer 5.2.2.2 Tabelleneigenschaften was changed from e to i so the collision is now removed and the two accelerators are exactly the opposite from  those of 4.3.3.2.  
Please note that now in 5.2.2.2 in the context menu Einfügen has e when the cursor is in a table, but n when outside a table (see above).  What the **?! 

Or, for instance, take Calc's Search&Replace menu where I often need to activate »In allen Tabellen suchen« (Search in all tables): 
• In Calc 4.3.3.2 I typed  Ctrl-H Alt+O Alt+C  
• In Calc 5.1.4.2 the menu is basically the same but just that last accelerator c got lost so it was now Ctrl+H Alt+O Tab Tab Tab Tab Tab Space.
• In Calc 5.2.2.2 the menu was redesigned, this checkbox moved up from Options but no underlined characters at all anymore!  They only appear when pressing Alt which I take to be another new bug, certainly no feature.  My checkbox is renamed to »Alle Tabellen» and still has no accelerator, so it is now Ctrl+H Tab Tab Tab Tab Space.  What will it be next week?  

Can you feel my pain?  Do you really expect users to comb through all menus every few weeks and write a dozen bug reports about moved accelerators?  Just compiling these examples took a good hour.
Comment 12 Yousuf Philips (jay) 2016-10-13 03:09:07 UTC
(In reply to HansPL from comment #11)
> Sorry, but I do not find this to be true. At least not in my German LO, so
> this is probably more of an l10n issue.  

Yes it was incorrect for me to say we as I meant I as i only deal with english.

> Take for instance the context menu (menu key or right mouse button) in
> Writer, which triggered my above rant:  From 5.1.4.2 to 5.2.2.2  seven out
> of ten accelerators were changed where there was absolutely no need:  
> • Einfügen  from i to n 
> • Inhalte einfügen  from I to h 
> • Zeichen…  from c to Z 
> • Absatz…  from b to t
> • Aufzählungszeichen  from u to ä 
> • Absatzvorlage  from nothing to e 
> • Synonyme  from m to S  

Yes the context menu went through a major change, as it is now possible for users to change it and many of the old strings were lost with this change and would need to be reintroduced.

> And where could I customize this context menu?  Which is not an option
> anyway because I use LO in different versions on five different Linux
> machines (Mint LMDE Mate) plus sometimes on colleague's Windows machines…  

Its only available in 5.2 and you can install it on any version of linux or windows by downloading the install from the libreoffice.org website.

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/5.2#Configuration

> Can you feel my pain?  Do you really expect users to comb through all menus
> every few weeks and write a dozen bug reports about moved accelerators? 
> Just compiling these examples took a good hour.

Yes i can feel your pain, but users who jump between multiple different versions of any software will experience changes and pains. Unfortunately maintaining accelerators keys across different versions isnt something that can be achieved or set high priority on, so i'd recommend you stick with a version that you are comfortable with until things completely setting down with accelerators.
Comment 13 HansPL 2016-12-09 13:54:56 UTC
(In reply to Yousuf Philips (jay) from comment #12)
> (In reply to HansPL from comment #11)
> […] Unfortunately
> maintaining accelerators keys across different versions isnt something that
> can be achieved or set high priority on, […] 

I'm sorry to hear this.  I would think it is a small effort just to look back to the previous version and just choosing the same accelerators as before, compared to actually writing all this code.  (For which I'm really very grateful to all you devs!)  

Anyway, this is getting some (in)fame:  see http://xkcd.com/1770/ 
I'm not the only one…